This is the full video of the debate between Murdo Fraser (MSP) and Richard Lucas of Solas and John Mason (MSP) and David Robertson of Solas, in Charlotte Chapel, Edinburgh on the 11th of June. It was a good and lively night…
The Blog of David Robertson
This is the full video of the debate between Murdo Fraser (MSP) and Richard Lucas of Solas and John Mason (MSP) and David Robertson of Solas, in Charlotte Chapel, Edinburgh on the 11th of June. It was a good and lively night…
I did watch part of this film – so really I should try and complete the viewing. However, one of the things that struck me was how little economic considerations and actual detail was on offer. Plenty of “feeling” and “maybes” – very little in terms of concrete or observable facts.
I contrast this with a “secular” Referendum debate on Tuesday in Glasgow which really was a breath of fresh air, in the vegan cafe Stereo. It featured a speaker from the Radical Independence Conference, a speaker from the Communist Party of Britain, and Patrick Harvie from the Green Party.
Before any of them spoke, a number of poets and artists performed their works as a prelude to the “speeches”.
The whole thing was a great experience – perhaps the most non-sectarian referendum debate that i have attended thus far?!
I’m curious. Have you ever been at a sectarian referendum debate? Where was that?
YOu were at a ‘debate’ on Independence which consisted of the Radical INdependence Conference, Patrick Harvie and the Communist Party. Which one of them was speaking for the Union?!
Sectarianism abounds at almost every Referendum debate that I have been to! The whole of Facebook and Twitter is awash with the most mad and partisan and biased channels of information or misinformation?!
The debate that I made reference to last Tuesday was unique in my experience, in that it was respectful and courteous! However, a similarly good and wholesome debate with the whole gambit of ideas was held by the Clydebank Trades Union Council recently – with folks detailing their various reasons for their attitudes to the Referendum http://clydebanktuc.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=29:video-should-the-working-class-support-independence&catid=3:videos&Itemid=24
I’m no economist, but economics is important, far above feelings!
Actually none were speaking for the “Union” as though the only alternative to “Independence” was the Status Quo!
All were speaking out against the horrendous Capitalist Austerity ideologically-driven assaults on the poorest and most vulnerable people in society. Sadly the likes of the Christian Institute, for all their valuable work, are more likely to mirror the rhetoric of the Daily Mail rather than the gospels of Jesus, and condemn needy folks as scroungers!
The Communist Party of Britain is offering a clear analysis of a progressive “No” vote http://www.scottishcommunists.org.uk/scottish-referendum-2014/blog
But even the neutral likes of the Clydebank Trades Union Council have held vital and balanced debates on the Referendum with 2 speakers on each side who showed at least some respect to each other: http://clydebanktuc.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=29:video-should-the-working-class-support-independence&catid=3:videos&Itemid=24
Cailean, I think you will find that the debate which this thread is about was respectful….I should also point out that you can vote yes or no at the referendum. Those are the only options. Any debate on the referendum should reflect both points of view.
And I think you will find that our debate was respectful and courteous.
I think we can give thanks that both recent meetings that we attended were “respectful and courteous” – a positive rarity in this whole political scene.
Although i rather cheekily fast-forwarded bits in the video you linked to, I still felt that there was much about perception and feelings which didn’t address the nitty-gritty of economic figures or reality & ideological considerations that could be argued are important (I am no economist nor ideologue, so am often at the mercy of people more intelligent than I).
I made reference to the Clydebank Trade Union Council public debate for those same reasons. Clydebank TUC has a long and noble history of community politics, and they organised a great public meeting which unlike so many was balanced (its amazing how many are like the Tommy Sheridan rallies or only presenting one viewpoint – like shooting fish in a barrel).
I’ve already been called all sorts of colourful names in this debate – traitor, quisling, collaborator (like Scotland is akin to Nazi-occupied France?) and so on. That’s all ok – such people don’t like being reminded of what plenty Scots (including shamefully members of my own clan) were complicit in. Scots aren’t “genetically” or culturally more Left wing than Germans are “genetically” or culturally right wing! Such talk or thought is pure madness & self-deception!
One only has to look to Eastern Europe and see the poison of Fascism & Racism parade itself quite proudly when only 30 years ago Marxist Socialism was the accepted outlook. Even in the Western Ukraine last month, Ukrainian SS soldiers were exhumed and buried with civic honours by people dressed in period SS Uniform, blessed by Orthodox Catholic priests in the collected presence of the local Government!!! Of course, none of this was broadcast in Western media as it didn’t fit with the narrative that they were trying to convey!
I am a member of Hope not Hate – an anti-Facist anti-Racist society/ charity. The level of far-Right influence is frightening, especially in places where a few decades ago it was illegal!
So I don’t believe that Scots (or British) are any sort of magical society. In deed, the popularity of some of the most horrendous newspapers like the Daily Mail are evidence that reactionary “blame politics” & popular demonisation of benefits recipients by the likes of ian Duncan Smith are evidence that Capitalist media is winning the ideological war to turn us against each other!